New color choices for building painting - includes new poll

Tom,

You mentioned "we're just trying to find an alternate color combination and a majority seem to like the current option". Can you please tell me what is the current option on the table?

Thanks,
-Yasser

Yasser wrote:Tom,

You mentioned "we're just trying to find an alternate color combination and a majority seem to like the current option". Can you please tell me what is the current option on the table?

Thanks,
-Yasser

Hi,

The current option I was referring to is the one in the pictures on page one of this thread.

Admin wrote:Hi,

So am I Hugo Chavez now??

In all seriousness, am I not allowed to have an opinion? If I was completely out of touch with what the majority wanted then I certainly wouldn't press ahead with my opinion but the poll Helen keeps referring to had a majority wanting change. Now, we're just trying to find an alternate color combination and a majority seem to like the current option.

That being said Marcelle did some photoshop work with the current option on the rest of the building with some different shading and I must admit the colors look dull. Glad I saw this before the meeting with the color consultant.

Hey, Tom,

Of course you're allowed to have an opinion (whether or not you agree with the majority), and I hope you do express it. It might deflect some flak if you distinguish when you're speaking as a board member and when you're not. I do wish the other board members would chime in also with their opinions.

However, when you are voting in board meetings as a board member, you are representing the homeowners. In that case, your personal opinion needs to have no more weight than anyone else's personal opinion. Few can manage that level of impartiality. Those board members who consistently vote based on their own opinions rather than the will of their constituents are not representing the homeowners; they are representing themselves and are unlikely to be re-elected.

Here's the poll I keep referring to:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Earth tones/browns (Like the current sample on the corner) 18% 18% [ 8 ]
Use the original colors, do not change them. 38% 38% [ 17 ]
Use an updated version of what we have. (Keep the colors light and warm) 40% 40% [ 18 ]
Tan and Olive combination (Olive may need to be tweaked slightly) 2% 2% [ 1 ]
Total Votes : 44
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Clearly, only 20% wanted any sort of earth tones (hardly a majority), and 78% wanted either the original colors or some version of the current colors. It's true that we know what the current colors look like, even though they are somewhat faded and dusty. Many of us occasionally hose down the parts of the building we can reach with a garden hose - so that's not really an issue; we know what it looks like. 38%, however, wanted the original colors, which we haven't seen in about ten years. Could we see a sample of those colors?

Or could we see a sample of any color that doesn't have a brown component? We've seen chocolate brown, yellow-brown, green-brown,.... The only thing I've seen that doesn't have a brown component is the blue awning, which I do rather like (I think it's on page 1 of this thread). The yellow would be acceptable if it were more clear - a pastel primary yellow - and it would be pretty with the clear blue.

I really like the vertical idea, if I'm understanding it correctly (neighboring units in the same building having different color schemes). We could have different combinations that way, possibly even painting the doors and window frames in the accent color. I don't think the earth tones would work with the pastel primaries very well, but it might make sense to have some buildings done in pastel primary and secondary colors, and other buildings done in earth tones. The homeowners in each building could decide what their overall scheme would be.

Everyone would be happy, or else we'd have chaos. :-)

I asked earlier about the color committee. Is there a color committee? If so, who's on it?

There have been many references to the color consultant. Who is this person, and what are his/her qualifications?

Could we see Marcelle's photoshop work?

Helen

I completely agree with JBrowning....we need a change!! The current colors are SO outdated (can anyone say Miami Vice....1980s?). It seems that there are a lot of homeowners who are not open to change and want to keep the same ol' drab, outdated colors. It's time to let go of the past as the place needs a facelift. Our complex is so beautiful and with an updated look it will bring out its beauty even more. The old colors have GOT TO GO.

The current sample colors are nice, but I believe we need to go a few shades darker on the bottom. It was nice before with the bottom dark brown sample and how the garage doors would pop! As for the awnings...the blue is better but it does need some tweaking. Maybe try for a palate with a color that will pop more.

Tom,

Are we going to get a few samples of the new color scheme with some tweakings, as the pole suggests, before making the final decision?

I am open to have new colors in the complex but if the final version of the new color scheme is not going to be as good as what we have now, then I would like to stick with the old/existing color scheme.

I think we should first finalize the new color scheme. Once it is final then have everyone vote betweem the new color scheme option(s) and the old/existing color scheme. Whichever option gets the most vote should be implemented.

I registered yesterday so I have not voted yet on this thread. I will vote "Yes" if there will be final round of voting once we have all the options finalized. I will vote "No" if we are going to have the new color scheme regardless how they turn out at the end. So please clarify so I can cast my vote accordingly

I would also like to THANK YOU for all your efforts!!

Regards,
-Yasser

Are we painting the common inside hallways?

BTW, I think the BOD is doing a great job trying to make everyone happy with picking the new colors.

Dave

Hi Everyone,

Let me try and answer some of the latest questions. Today is a bit busy for me so please excuse the short answers.

We will be painting the common hallways but not as part of exterior painting project. That will come separately and obviously will need to match the exterior. Thank you for the compliment! I assure you we are trying to do our best.

Hi Yasser, Welcome and thanks for joining. We've been working on these colors for a while now and we are almost done at this point. So i don't believe there will be any more polls at this point. The board did decide a while back that they will make the final decision on the colors.

We met with the painting consultant on Wednesday and went down two paths. One was to slightly tweak the last scheme in this thread by darkening the base color and tweaking the accent color. Then we also went down a different path that was suggested by Jean. An even lighter color for the main portion and instead of the browns we went towards tope for the base and pop out. At one point we had about a dozen people in front of building 450. After many back and forth on shades we voted and the topes won.

We expect the vendor to paint the new colors early next week.

Take care,
Tom

PS - I will be out for a few days with no PC so I won't be able to monitor this forum until I get back.

The new building color is much better. My personal opinion is that it should be a little darker so it won't show the dirt as much. As for the awnings the red looks like rust has formed and the blue isn't great either. I definitely like the green more. We should also consider the possibility using brown for the awnings and rails.

The current color scheme is classic 1980's NAGEL. It is dated. Needs to be completely changed.

The new proposed color scheme is good. However, I would find a different metal color. The metal color
should not "pop" with contrast. Why? Think about it. The metal railings are over 20 years old and very
dated by todays standards. That means the metal railings are very old school. The railings put a date
stamp on the Villagio complex.

So, why accentuate them to make them stand out and "pop" ?
It would be better to tone them down and make the metal more subdued. A color to do that would
give the Villagio complex a softer more integrated feel. This would work better.

Just my opinion. P.S. The orange color has to go.

krj1000 wrote:The current color scheme is classic 1980's NAGEL. It is dated. Needs to be completely changed.

Thanks for the comments!

So first of all, let me say I'm sorry but this latest feedback was not received in time to make it into our latest discussions with the color consultant. In my previous post I mentioned that we met with the color consultant last week and I provided the feedback from this forum. I think most if not all of the board members read all the comments also.

We took the current sample (the one at the beginning of this thread) and asked the color consultant to tweak it. Slightly brighter body color and a darker base (the bottom) and a new accent/trim color. Everyone hated the terra-cotta aka rust. I thought the blue had potential but the majority of board preferred to go with a green. Once we found those colors, Jean suggested another direction using brighter colors. We went through the process of finding a bright off-white and found a couple of topes that looked very clean and sophisticated (my opinion). It was matched up with a dark green as the accent color. Once we had the 2 different color schemes we voted on which of the two would we go with. Several homeowners were there and participated by expressing their opinions. Overall, we were there for two hours debating the pro's and con's of each color scheme. What matched the roofs, the courtyards, stood out from other complexes, which was more timeless, how they would show dirt, would the colors be liked by others, etc, etc, etc....

In the end, we chose the tope combination. Hopefully the painter will put it up this week. If the colors on the walls match the swatches and it looks good right, this will be it!

Back to my day job...

Hi, Tom,

Or the current/original colors still on the table?

Who is on the color committee?

Helen

Hi Helen,

I think its fair to say that after this last meeting its clear that the old colors are no longer on the table.

As far as the decision, I think I've been consistent and said the board would make the decision.

Take care,
Tom

I'm going to try and say this as nicely as possible so no one accuses me of being inconsiderate.

I'm happy to hear the old colors are out of the running and that a decision is close. Please do not let one homeowner sway the board into making a poor decision.

Thank you.

Admin wrote:Hi Helen,

I think its fair to say that after this last meeting its clear that the old colors are no longer on the table.

As far as the decision, I think I've been consistent and said the board would make the decision.

Take care,
Tom

Tom,

You said recently that they were still on the table. Do you mean to say that the board, at the last meeting, decided to take them off the table? If so, what went into this decision?

I didn't ask who'd make the decision; it's been very clear that the board will make the decision. What I asked was: who is on the color committee? I've asked this before and have yet to get an answer.

Helen

JBrowning wrote:I'm going to try and say this as nicely as possible so no one accuses me of being inconsiderate.

I'm happy to hear the old colors are out of the running and that a decision is close. Please do not let one homeowner sway the board into making a poor decision.

Thank you.

You have a right to your opinion, and the freedom to voice it. So do I.

And we all have the right to be treated with respect.

Helen

Helen Woodson wrote:

Admin wrote:Hi Helen,

I think its fair to say that after this last meeting its clear that the old colors are no longer on the table.

As far as the decision, I think I've been consistent and said the board would make the decision.

Take care,
Tom

Tom,

You said recently that they were still on the table. Do you mean to say that the board, at the last meeting, decided to take them off the table? If so, what went into this decision?

I didn't ask who'd make the decision; it's been very clear that the board will make the decision. What I asked was: who is on the color committee? I've asked this before and have yet to get an answer.

Helen

I'll speak for myself only.

In no particular order... Our color consultant felt the colors were very dated, which I agree with. The majority of homeowners I have spoken to prefer a change. Based on the polls from this forum, I believe the majority want new colors.

As far as your question about who is on the painting committee - I've never used the term, I believe someone else wrote board/painting committee in one of their postings. I suppose you could say each of the board members is on the painting committee, plus the consultant and I'd even say one homeowner who was passionate about the subject and got involved.

Admin wrote:

I'll speak for myself only.

In no particular order... Our color consultant felt the colors were very dated, which I agree with. The majority of homeowners I have spoken to prefer a change. Based on the polls from this forum, I believe the majority want new colors.

As far as your question about who is on the painting committee - I've never used the term, I believe someone else wrote board/painting committee in one of their postings. I suppose you could say each of the board members is on the painting committee, plus the consultant and I'd even say one homeowner who was passionate about the subject and got involved.

Tom,

The color consultant doesn't live here or (as far as I know) own any property here, so why would this person have a greater voice than the homeowners? You may have spoken to many homeowners; I wasn't one of them, but I did make the effort to vote in the polls.

78% of those in the first poll said they wanted either the original colors or some flavor of the current colors. 20% wanted new colors. What is this, Really New Math, where 20% is the majority? Or maybe it's 1984 and this is doublespeak.

I didn't say painting committee; I said color committee - oh, never mind. Which homeowner got to be in on the decision? I think I'm about as passionate as anyone about the issue, and I'd like to have been involved. How does one go about getting involved? Perhaps by agreeing with the Powers That Be?

Helen, feeling disenfranchised

Another thing - all homeowners bought their homes here with either the original colors or the current colors - including those homeowners who now detest these colors.

So why would anyone buy a place that was an ugly color - and then insist on changing it, overriding the wishes of the majority of those who voted?

The second poll was just "are we on the right track" for selecting an alternate to the present or original colors. The old colors were supposed to be still on the table, only there was no sample because we know what they look like.

I think it's really terrible that the board has decided to disregard the expressed wishes of the 78% who actually bothered to vote in the first poll. They got by with it by having a meeting that wasn't announced. That's just wrong.

Helen

Again, you are distorting the truth. My response from the other thread applies here also.

---------------------

I completely disagree with you.

You are distorting one poll and completely ignoring a second one just to try and justify your opinion. Only 38% wanted the same colors, everyone else wanted a change. The only question is in what direction and how bold of a change it would be.

We first started with this.



We then took the first poll. It was clear that the majority did NOT like this scheme. So what did the board do? We asked the painter for a different color scheme that was more like what we had.



The main color is light, similiar to what we have.

We received mixed opinions on this combination. So we tried again and came up with this.



Again we had mixed opinions on the result. At that point board felt that we may need a different professional who we should seek advice from, who wasn't affiliated with the painter. After listening to the forum and homeowners who came to the board meetings, we came up with this. (There were 2 different swatches posted on this forum before we painted)



We presented these colors and ran another poll. Which a majority seems to like. However, like the poll said, the scheme may need some tweaks. We took the feedback on more contrast, a lighter main color and a different accent color and came up with a new scheme, which isn't even painted yet.

So I ask you, did the board NOT take input from homeowners??

Nice response Tom!

Helen, I voted for a similar scheme to what we have but do not feel the board ignored me. In fact, I think they've gone out of their way to include everyones opinion. So please do not include my vote for your cause.

Don't include me in your 78% either. Also, please make sure this women is not on any committee, I sense nothing but trouble.

Thanks for the support, however I want to stress to JBrowning (again) NO personal attacks. Let's keep the conversations on the topic.

Admin wrote:Again, you are distorting the truth. My response from the other thread applies here also.

---------------------

I completely disagree with you.

You are distorting one poll and completely ignoring a second one just to try and justify your opinion. Only 38% wanted the same colors, everyone else wanted a change. The only question is in what direction and how bold of a change it would be.

....

So I ask you, did the board NOT take input from homeowners??

Tom,

I'll thank you to keep a civil tongue in your head and remind you of what you said to JBrowning - NO personal attacks!

I believe you are misinterpreting what the polls showed. 38% wanted the original color; 40% wanted some flavor of the current colors. I read that as 78% for something very similar to the original/current colors. 20% wanted brown/earth/tan/olive tones. In a later poll, a bare majority of 6 people agreed that you were on the right path - which was understood to be a refinement of one of the two choices. The other was going to be the original/current colors, which you said were still on the table.

If you disagree with this reading, that doesn't mean you're distorting anything or disregarding anything. And I can disagree honestly also. Can you accept that? Can you buy that people who disagree with you do so in good faith?

You said earlier that the polls would not be a factor in the decision, that the board would make the decision. And that turns out to be the case. So, yes, the board took input from the homeowners - and disregarded any input that wasn't aligned with their opinions (and that of the color consultant and the one homeowner).

One of the pictures reveals who the mystery homeowner is who got to participate; it's none other than Italia (a.k.a. Debra Hill), who's been clamoring to let the board and the "color committee" make the decision and *not* to allow the homeowners to participate in said decision. Interesting.

The homeowners were not notified of the last board meeting, which was not at the regular time; and inquiries as to when it was got no response. Should we interpret that to mean that the board did not want the homeowners at large to be present, that only those homeowners who supported the trend to brown were notified and able to attend?

Is there a rush to make a decision by the current board and implement it before the election? Should we perhaps consider having the homeowners themselves make this decision? I for one am willing to live with being outvoted, and I expect everyone else is, too. What we don't like is having something crammed down our throats, regardless of what the majority wants.

I would remind you that you have not responded to the request for the identity of the color consultant. Would you please do so?

Regards,

Helen (a.k.a. Trouble)

Helen Woodson wrote:

Admin wrote:Again, you are distorting the truth. My response from the other thread applies here also.

---------------------

I completely disagree with you.

You are distorting one poll and completely ignoring a second one just to try and justify your opinion. Only 38% wanted the same colors, everyone else wanted a change. The only question is in what direction and how bold of a change it would be.

....

So I ask you, did the board NOT take input from homeowners??

Tom,

I'll thank you to keep a civil tongue in your head and remind you of what you said to JBrowning - NO personal attacks!

I believe you are misinterpreting what the polls showed. 38% wanted the original color; 40% wanted some flavor of the current colors. I read that as 78% for something very similar to the original/current colors. 20% wanted brown/earth/tan/olive tones. In a later poll, a bare majority of 6 people agreed that you were on the right path - which was understood to be a refinement of one of the two choices. The other was going to be the original/current colors, which you said were still on the table.

If you disagree with this reading, that doesn't mean you're distorting anything or disregarding anything. And I can disagree honestly also. Can you accept that? Can you buy that people who disagree with you do so in good faith?

You said earlier that the polls would not be a factor in the decision, that the board would make the decision. And that turns out to be the case. So, yes, the board took input from the homeowners - and disregarded any input that wasn't aligned with their opinions (and that of the color consultant and the one homeowner).

One of the pictures reveals who the mystery homeowner is who got to participate; it's none other than Italia (a.k.a. Debra Hill), who's been clamoring to let the board and the "color committee" make the decision and *not* to allow the homeowners to participate in said decision. Interesting.

The homeowners were not notified of the last board meeting, which was not at the regular time; and inquiries as to when it was got no response. Should we interpret that to mean that the board did not want the homeowners at large to be present, that only those homeowners who supported the trend to brown were notified and able to attend?

Is there a rush to make a decision by the current board and implement it before the election? Should we perhaps consider having the homeowners themselves make this decision? I for one am willing to live with being outvoted, and I expect everyone else is, too. What we don't like is having something crammed down our throats, regardless of what the majority wants.

I would remind you that you have not responded to the request for the identity of the color consultant. Would you please do so?

Regards,

Helen (a.k.a. Trouble)

OK, my last post for the night. I don't get paid enough for this, oh wait....I'm not paid for this.

It seems your strategy is to wear me down and just keep repeating the same argument even though I already addressed it by pointing out how the color selection evolved over time. I think we're just going to have to agree to disagree. Sounds to me like other homeowners who voted for similar light colors do not agree with you either.

"Italia" aka Debra was not involved in picking the colors and did not attend last weeks meeting with the color consultant. So you are wrong on your assertion. If the homeowner who did participate wants to identify themselves then they will do so. I'm not comfortable naming them. What I will say is that homeowner monitors this forum and also expressed their preference for the original colors. However, they voted for the new colors also.

2 meetings took place in the last 2 weeks. One was a normal board meeting. The other was a meeting with the painting consultant (Jill Denton). While the normal notice for the board meeting was not posted, I posted a message on this website and several homeowners came to the meeting. Again your claim about inquiries were not responded to is false also. The homeowners who were present monitor this forum and if they want to identify themselves they can.

I would hardly call this process a "rush". We have evaluated numerous schemes over 3 months now.

No one is cramming anything down anyones throat. I haven't heard anyone else express this, you seem to be the only one who feels that way. Perhaps you are not being honest with yourself when you say you can live with being out voted?

Have a good night.

Tom,

I don't think it's appropriate for you to speculate about my motives or my "strategy", nor is it appropriate for you to suggest that I am dishonest. You're no longer talking about the issues; you're simply attacking your perceived opponent.

I think that, as a board member, you have a particular obligation to maintain a civil discourse. If you cannot or will not discuss an issue with homeowners without resorting to insult and innuendo, you demonstrate your unfitness for this leadership position; and you should resign. If you will point out a response to an inquiry about the time of the next meeting, I will stand corrected with apologies. Simply accusing me of making false statements is not a rational response; it is entirely possible that one of us is simply mistaken and not a liar.

It is true that you posted about the last board meeting; that post went up either the day of the meeting or the day before (I don't recall which). That's not adequate notice, and it is possible that a board meeting that is not announced with adequate notice to all homeowners is illegal. Many homeowners are not members of this forum, and many do not read it every day. We all have a right to know about and attend all board meetings.

Thank you for identifying the painting consultant, Jill Denton. Will you please tell us her qualifications? I have asked for this information before.

We elected the board of directors. If the board has appointed any individual to a committee or anything else, the homeowners have a right to know the identity of this person. No person has the right to remain anonymous and avoid accountability while making decisions with which the rest of us must live.

We do disagree greatly on our interpretations of the original poll and the second one. It's not disputed that 38% voted for the original colors in the original poll, but that's about the only thing that's not in dispute. Various choices have been presented and discussed at length in several different threads, to the point that it's been difficult to keep up with what's being considered.

Accordingly, I have put up two new polls. There's no need to argue about the desires of the majority; let's simply find out. I am quite willing to abide by the vote of the majority, and I hope that the board will do so as well.

There's one problem with these polls; none of us have been verified as members of the HOA in order to be a member of this forum. Many people use a pseudonym. So there is no way of knowing if those who vote are homeowners or if those who join the forum have more than one userid. That's why it would be better to put this question to the homeowners at the annual meeting.

By the way, when is the annual meeting? And who is standing for election to the Board?

Helen

Helen